I'm at the end of my patience

General
1

I’m at my wit’s end with this remote control.

Years ago, before IPTV even existed, I had a Dreambox DVB receiver. You could customize and program it to your liking. From pay-TV channel encryption to custom channel icons and who knows what else, everything was possible.

But at some point, I was so busy trying to get the thing working that I couldn’t actually use it for its primary purpose: watching TV.

It was more like a never-ending project. New firmware, new OS, updates, etc…

The Remote 3 is the same story.

I’m constantly trying to get it working without even being able to use it for what I bought it for in the first place.

And it’s a constant struggle. Searching in forums or Discord. Docker here, integration there. Everything’s in beta.

Why did I even buy this? Why am I doing the work the manufacturer should have already done?

The final straw came recently when, after all that frustration, I bought a Sofabaton X2.

EUREKA, it works right away!!!

Half an hour to set up, including configuring it in Home Assistant and the Alexa skill. No constant charging, no Wi-Fi problems, etc. Absolutely perfect and cheaper.

I threw the Remote 3 and its dock straight in the trash. No joke. I wouldn’t even sell the thing.

Sure, some will disagree and make excuses like, “Well, it’s not a Logitech Harmony replacement,” or “That’s not the target audience.” But who exactly is the target audience?

In conclusion:

It probably sounds strange, but after all my experiences, I really wish it had been a Kickstarter scam. Then I would have bought a Sofabaton much sooner.

2

Not sure why you would throw it out when there are those of us who appreciate it for what it is and would gladly buy it from you (and if you’re offering a deal, I’m game).

I agree with you in some ways … UC is so engineering focused that they miss some basics about customer sensibilities. Some of their leadership is great at responding and trying to be helpful (particulary Markus in Discord), others not so much, but the overarching sensibility isn’t there.

This product is essentially a DIY version of a CI level integration platform and that was never explained to backers with either the R2 or the R3. I have a long history of programming Pronto devices (before Philips got out of the game) and URC CCP remotes (before they caved to their CI base and shut out DIYers). That’s why the learning curve on the R2/R3 didn’t bother me and I derive some utility out of the experience of making it work how I want it to. But, we were never told that’s what we were buying and I completely get your frustration.

I have a Sofabaton X1S and I know the X2 is a significant step forward but it’s primarily designed as an IR control device which is a much less desirable platform than IP and the integrations it does offer aren’t very well developed. If that changes in time, that may change my perception of the remote. OTOH, my experience with Sofabaton makes the X2 a non-starter (it cannot properly control STBs on the X1 platform … the IR cannot be tuned to send a single button press for example). I am only pointing that it is a promising product but has its shortcomings too.

3

I’m almost as fed up as xenoton.

I keep thinking about just getting rid of these damn things (R2/R3) so I don’t even have to look at them anymore—they’re getting on my nerves so much by now. It’s just unusable/unreasonable for a normal user. That’s why I still use my Prono TSU9400—it’s simply the better remote. It works—always. No connection drops, and the battery lasts a week. Pronto Edit is a dream.

4

I think there are a number of issues with UC. The deal breaker is the poor radio performance which means you need a bulletproof wireless connection before anything else. In my case what did the trick was switching to 2.4Ghz.

Once you have a stable connection you have to plan how to control your devices. IP works best but the number of supported devices through third party development is admittedly very limited.

IR is hit and miss. The docks perform poorly, there is no IR library available on the platform so you are left to figure out yourself where to source the codes, in a compatible format, for a specific device. Even with the codes, IR does not always trigger my amplifier and I have not figured out a way to control my dCS stack yet. Also switching between activities, when IR devices are involved, can cause frustration. It’s a best effort affair since the remote does not receive status feedback from IR controlled devices.

And the battery life is indeed poor by remote control standards. It essentially measures in hours rather than days / weeks.

Having said that, if you achieve a stable connection and most of your devices support IP control, UC is a powerful remote which is infinitely customisable and reliable most of the time with the latest firmware updates. A couple of months ago I used to reach regularly for my
Harmony as UC would fail to trigger certain devices. Now I am seriously thinking about selling my Harmony because it has not seen any use in at least 8 weeks and that platform will sooner or later be abandoned by Logitech.

I personally would buy UC for the IP control, if most of your devices are supported with integrations. Luckily, in my case, they are. If you need mostly or exclusively IR control, Harmony is still a vastly superior remote with a comprehensive database, streamlined setup and bulletproof IR performance from their hubs and blasters.

5

Agree to Xenoton!! Bought a Sofabaton X2, sold the Remote 3 and after less than one day of programming the whole family is happy again :grinning_face:

6

Man, a lot the gripes you had are also gripes I had (but I’m keeping mine and finally replacing my Harmony Elites with ‘em):

  1. It takes forever to set up. It’s not that the Web UI is slow, it’s that you need to figure out how to use it, and it’s not intuitive at all! A lot of the abstractions seem so obtuse: “First add the entity, then you can add it to the sequence and the remote screen and buttons.”
  2. How do you find any info? There’s no AI on the site nor are the docs very good at giving you every detail. I’ve tried asking AI for help, but it knows basically nothing about this product :confused:.
  3. I used it last year and finally got it where I wanted when I learned about Activity Groups, but I programmed everything in Home Assistant automations (wrong way to do it), so it sat until I picked it up again in November only to have the device never come back online. I finally got it all working today, but man, so many issues.
  4. I spent all night trying to get the Remote 3 set up tonight. I’m talkin’ nearly 12 hours until I figured it out!
  5. I also heard early on people saying “it’s not like Harmony” but man would I have appreciated a “Logitech Harmony mode” to get me started. But I’ve not herad people saying it’s not the target audience.

I wouldn’t personally buy a Sofabaton because I don’t trust Chinese companies and especially don’t want their products in my home network or hooked up to Home Assistant. That’s a personal thing.

I also have 2 Harmony Elites that have been working for 12 years, so it’s not like I’m needing to move to another remote atm which is why I’ve been fiddling with the Remote 3.

7

Every time I see a comment comparing this experience to a Harmony with the notion that it should measure up to a Harmony, my reaction is that this is simply not the remote for you.

Harmony had ease of setup and the “Activity” paradigm down pat. That made is a good mass consumer remote. But it’s not a good remote … these are two completely different classes of products. This is for someone looking for a URC, Control4, RTi type experience on a DIY basis without having to go to a CI. It’s an incredibly powerful platform and has really good hardware and ergonomics (the R3, the R2 has some flaws).

That is not a criticism of the buyer who is frustrated, that’s on UC for not properly marketing the remote and making it clear what you were buying.

I think Harmony is junk and I dislike the product. That makes me the perfect customer for UC and the niche they are trying to fit into. Despite the fact that I think they do a poor job of customer service and I had a very poor experience with them and one of their senior peeps on that front, I still think it’s a product worth supporting because there’s no one else out there doing this. Everyone else is trying to make you go CI or is ridiculously overpriced (and Sofabaton doesn’t count … different space).

8

I’m not quite sure what the difference is, so I’d like you to elaborate.

A friend’s dad has a Crestron system in his house, but his remotes were basically Harmony-like universal remote devices. This is in the mid-2000s.

Aside from having native Home Assistant controls and being newer than the old Harmony Elite, what’s the market Sofabaton and Harmony are handling that’s different?

Harmony even supports smart devices and has many integrations with smart home systems. It also has custom button mappings for that very purpose as you can see here:

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I think a lot of the fact that has made Harmony “bad” is the fact that it’s based on a late 90s Windows-first software package. On top of that, Logitech stopped all production about 10 years ago. So now we’re comparing an ancient device to something brand new.

But in my mind, these two are the exact same thing just that Harmony had many limitations, the biggest being its reliance on the cloud and proprietary software.

9

Even with the reliance on cloud and sluggish software, the Harmony just simple works. When anyone in my family picked up the Harmony Elite and pressed the “pause” button the remote whatever they were watching actually paused.

They didn’t have to wait a second or two until the Remote3 decided it wanted to play ball, or look at a “Device not available” error message and look puzzled at the remote.

I see all the DIY extras of the Remote3 as extras, things it should do as a nice added bonus. It fundamentally fails as a remote for regular people. The physical design of it is nice, a bit sharp maybe, but that design seems to have dictacted everything from poor battery life, heat issues and them insisting on putting all the brains in the remote itself and not the dock.

I hope these things can get fixed with firmware, I really want to love this remote. But until I can just press the “Pause” button without having to lift the remote to wake it up, then it for me at least has fundamentally failed at the main task - controlling the home theater.

10

As many here have already mentioned, it’s a niche product.

From the diffusion of innovation theory perspective, UC has never broken out of the chasm and has remained stuck with early adopters.

Personally, I don’t see any vision of them moving forward, as there’s no innovation for the average consumer.

But that’s perfectly fine and also part of their strategy. The next Kickstarter for the Remote 4 will surely be a bigger success and raise even more money. Maybe this time they’ll include AI integration and a subscription model.

11

AI and subscription model would for me be a deal breaker. I love the fact that it is all running locally. We use the R3 every day for all music/video activities and are very happy with it.

12

UC has added various functions to avoid these startup errors like prevent sleep, keep WiFi connected in standby and repeating a command when it failed. The latter currently only works with single command and not activity sequences but this will be added at some point. They also mentioned optimizing the battery life on a hardware level.

13

agree for 100% with @kennymc.c

I used the R3 since 11 Month now and it works great, no IR, no lag ging and with all the 2-way feedback i need for my ip-devices. Only battery drain is awful…

14

It’s decided—I’m giving up too: Selling R2 and R3 incl. Docks (Switzerland)

15

Having just watched the Sofabaton X2 explanation video for the first time… it’s awfully hard to justify hanging onto my Remote 3 when the Sofa appears to surpass it in almost every way. I love the idea of the Remote 3, and will continue to stick it out for a while longer hoping for a miracle from Unfolded, but there’s such a gap between them that I can’t imagine that happening. In nearly every category, the Sofa is just way ahead. I do love the depth of the Remote 3, and its potential to be a mini computer for controlling devices, but so much has fallen flat, and its pace toward full bloom is just achingly slow.

I may even get a Sofa just to play around and see how it really feels in-person.

16

Thats simply not true. What are these categories?

2 Likes
17

Just wanted to give a quick update after a week with the Sofabaton X2.

It’s still working perfectly!

No issues, and believe it or not, despite heavy use, the battery is still almost a quarter full. I’ve now set up my Shelly 2PM directly with the Sofabaton, since you can address IP devices via HTTP requests. This way, the blinds are controlled directly and close when the projector starts.

Everything is super easy because it’s user-friendly and customer-oriented.

I’ve even taken my Harmony out of service now, as it’s working so well that I’m finally happy to have found a worthy replacement.

And so my long journey has come to an end.

Feel free to continue arguing about whether UC is better and blah blah blah :rofl:

2 Likes
18

I am not a technical guy. I used Harmony for what Harmony was - a remote. I used UFC3 for what it is, a remote. I set it up using YouTube and these forums and help from the various community devs - and I have not had to reconfigure it (touchwood) for over 8 months. It just works. I don’t need it to tell me weather or wifi signal strength of my house. I need it to run pure automation and control my entire HT setup, and it does that seamlessly.

TL;DR

It’s a remote and replaces my Harmony remote like for like

It’s a beautiful piece of hardware which trumps the plastic of harmony any day

Its local so I never need to pay for subscription or some stupid app to control my workflows

And finally - all those complaining about the beta version - guys you probably bought this through Kickstarter. Go and read the KS disclaimers if in doubt - they are not a marketplace shop, and innovators are not obligated to give you a polished product.

2 Likes
19

Glad you found something that works for you! Must feel really good to finally be rid of something stressful like that.

I personally won’t buy from a Chinese company, so I’m stuck finding another solution. I’m using the Remote 3 now, but there are all these little things leaving me still unhappy.